I recently held an AMA on how to succeed in law school. Compiled below are the questions and answers. Enjoy!
Update (8/20/19): I recently proofread and edited my portions of the AMA to improve clarity and readability. I did not do so for questions and answers written by other users, except to remove extraneous language (e.g., statements of thanks at the beginning/end of questions).
Question:
How does the summer job process work?
Sharper Statements:
Depends on the school and the sorts of job. Also depends on your class year.
For 1L summer jobs, people tend to start their search around December (might change with the new NALP rules). People apply anywhere from BL (hard to get) to judicial internships to public interest to government. You can apply by sending direct applications, through job fairs (usually public interest ones), or by answering a job post (often on your school’s job board, but sometimes you’ll find them on Indeed). Even students intent on BL often end up in public interest, or the like, during their first summer. Regardless of what you do, assuming it’s something legitimate, your grades will still be key for getting BL your second summer (unless you get BL your first summer, which will often lead to BL your second summer). If you plan on public interest for your second summer, definitely do something of that sort your first summer.
For 2L summer jobs, there will likely be another public interest fair. For government jobs, you’ll likely need to answer a post on your school job board or on the government website (or Indeed). I don’t think too many people do judicial internships their second summer, but I assume it would be the same approach as the first summer—by sending direct applications (mail or email, depending on the judge). For BL, schools will have their version of OCI—some with pre-select, some as a bidding system. T14 tend to be bidding, while lower-ranked schools tend to be pre-select. There’s also mass-mailing BL firms (many articles on TLS on it), which involves emailing a resume, short cover letter, and unofficial transcript. For the most part, these are had off a combination of school/grades. While networking can help somewhat, it’s not going to make that big of a difference for getting BL jobs. (Networking will make more of a difference when it comes to getting in the door with public interest and smaller firms.)
Keys for BL jobs are: 1) grades, 2) interview skills, 3) language skills/prior employment (i.e., not being a K-JD and having experience/skills that are somewhat relevant [speaking Mandarin is more useful than speaking Italian, for example]). The same way you do practice exams before the real exam, make sure you do as many mock interviews as possible. And do them with alumni at actual firms. Your OCS staff will likely offer to do them, but they often don’t provide good practice.
For post-graduation jobs, there’s 3L OCI (way more difficult to get BL from this than 2L OCI) and maybe some more public interest fairs. But many jobs are had by getting an offer after a second summer job. Alternatively, you can mass mail firms (BL and also mid and small law) as well as sending resumes to public interest firms and government entities.
Follow Up:
Is Mandarin (or other major languages such as Spanish) really seen as useful for BL jobs? I would think that only English matters given the work you do in BL.
I would also like to know as I speak some French and started learning Chinese in college.
Sharper Statements:
I would say Mandarin is the most commonly-useful language in BL other than English. But it depends on the firm (does it have international satellite offices?) and clients. If you have a major client from an Arabic-speaking country, speaking Arabic can be helpful.
I wouldn’t learn another language simply for BL, but students who are bilingual, trilingual, etc. gain an added boost.
Follow Up:
Didn’t realize this. Im intermediate in Arabic. If I wanted to improve my Arabic I guess I would have to do it before OCIs? Do you think there’s time during 1L/summer to do that?
Sharper Statements:
Only if it wouldn’t take away from your 1L studies. Speaking Arabic fluently would definitely be something that would stand out positively, but your 1L grades are still most important.
As for whether you’d have the time to become fluent, I have no clue. Sadly, I only speak one language fluently and a second, so-so.
Question:
Suggestions for classes to take 2L?
Interested in corporate practice, IP, and (unashamedly) boosting my GPA.
Oh, and when do you think we should take PR?
Sharper Statements:
For improving GPA, I’d focus more on what classes not to take, as even “easy” (e.g., animal rights law) classes aren’t easy per se. I’d avoid classes like fed courts and secured transactions. Put another way, avoid classes that top students (i.e., those pursuing Wachtell/Cravath and NY federal clerkships) are likely to take. I’d definitely avoid classes you’re likely to find boring. Assuming you’re not stuck with all the top students in one class (e.g., fed courts), your level of interest in the material is likely to correlate at least to some degree with how well you do. If it’s not too late, consider taking a seminar, as I believe those have more lenient curves than doctrinal classes.
I’d also avoid classes with difficult material or seminars that are likely to be very time consuming, as time spent focused on those courses will take away precious time from your other classes. While during 1L, you for the most part have the same classmates in each class (exception at NYU is the spring elective and Lawyering [ungraded, though]), in 2L and 3L overlap is less and those with easier classes will have more time to study across the board.
As for classes relevant to corporate practice, I’d definitely consider M&A, corporate finance, and the like. When choosing, get as much info on the professors as possible, as how beneficial the class is will be contingent on the professor. For IP, take the IP survey. I’d say the survey course’s material is medium level of difficulty, and a lot can be covered depending on the professor.
With PR, I’d take it the semester before you plan on doing the MPRE. I personally took it with Professor Chase and found it to be one of the easier classes I took (feel free to hit me up for my outline), so if you’re ready to take the MPRE, might be worth taking in the spring.
A last point: you’re unlikely to remember most of what you learn in law school once you’re in practice, so don’t worry too much about taking classes relevant to your goals. If you’re interested, great. If not, take classes you’ll find interesting.
Follow Up:
Wait, so say I am trying for a NY Federal clerkship, which classes should I take? I can gather fed courts and secured transactions. Any other you recommend?
Sharper Statements:
Secured transactions is a difficult area of law that can be worth taking for those pursuing corporate jobs where it’s prevalent (not for federal clerkships). While I said in my previous comment that courses you find interesting are the best choices, because you rarely remember what you learn in law school once you practice, difficult areas of law would be an exception to this. Having a strong foundation in such a subject could help with relearning it in practice.
Federal courts is useful for federal clerkships as is other litigation courses, such as complex litigation. I’d think that many judges will want to see federal courts on your transcript if you’re applying for a clerkship during 3L. For 2L apps, I think they’ll simply assume you’ll take it during 3L, so will be less concerned with it. I don’t think federal judges will be as concerned with whether you’ve taken complex litigation or not, but the course is helpful. If you’re pursuing a federal clerkship where multi-district litigation (or class actions) is prevalent, I’d definitely plan to take complex litigation.
Question:
Will coming into law school as a KJD screw up my chances of Biglaw? or is it just a small disadvantage. I’ve done a summer internship in undergrad but that’s about it in terms of work experience.
TryMyBanana:
Small disadvantage at most, but plenty of KJDs land BL jobs. Having WE before law school is a helpful talking point and reassurance that you can be professional in the workplace, among other things.
Sharper Statements:
I’d say either small disadvantage or simply lack of small advantage. TryMyBanana’s reasoning is spot on.
Question:
Are supplementals necessary for top grades?
Ever had a professor willing to give feedback on a sample test answer?
Sharper Statements:
Depends entirely on the person. I had some classes where I relied on supplements significantly (e.g., for Con Law, Chemerinsky’s supplement is key), while for others, I barely used one or didn’t at all (e.g., Civ Pro) (I actually used Professor Arthur Miller’s audio CDs for Civ Pro). What I often found to be most useful were old outlines from students who did well in that professor’s class (and asking such students for advice on how to best approach that professor/class). Supplements can easily teach the material differently than the professor or push your focus in the wrong direction. For example, the Erie Doctrine can be taught in a bunch of different ways and a supplement can easily teach it in a way your professor rejects.
I don’t think I ever asked a professor to review a sample answer per se, but I have run my thought processes regarding questions are on old exams by at least one professor. I’ve found that most professors (especially the new-age ones) are more than willing to answer your questions about pretty much anything relating to the class and even stuff beyond class. You just have to make the effort to build the relationship with them. I have spoken many times to professors after exams to find out where I specifically lost points and to get their advice on how I could improve on future exams.
Follow Up:
What is a supplement?
Sharper Statements:
Supplements are books written to teach students the law based on topic, with the focus being the law itself, with case excerpts mixed in. Different from casebooks where the law is taught mainly through cases.
Question:
Do you recommend briefing each case (and if so, what was your format)? I got my first few assigned.
Sharper Statements:
It depends on the person. I traditionally briefed one case during all of law school, and it was for a Lawyering assignment during orientation. I found my time better spent closely reading the cases and then I pulled up an old outline or online brief during class in case I was cold called.
For others, my advice is this: only brief cases if you have the time and you find it helpful. If those two factors ever stop (e.g., when you’re outlining and taking practice exams for finals), stop briefing. By no means is briefing required (unless your professor collects your briefs or makes it required) and many people do extremely well without briefing.
I want to stress again that briefing should never come before outlining and practice exams. The key to success in law school is figuring out what works, and quickly. If briefing feels time-consuming and is barely helpful early on, don’t keep doing it in hopes that you’ll soon love it. Instead, get advice from upperclassmen on what worked for them and quickly find what works for you.
TryMyBanana:
Do what works for you. I know some who stopped briefing after the first month. On the other hand, I briefed every case both semesters and found it helpful.
As for format, again, do what works for you. The typical points you want to cover, not in any particular order:
- Name/year/deciding court
- Facts
- Procedural history
- Legal rule
- Application/legal reasoning
- Holding/disposition of the case
I liked to highlight any questions I had for each brief to focus on during class/ask later. I also checked what I briefed against what Quimbee had to make sure I hit the main points.
Question:
When should I start outlining? How should I outline?
Sharper Statements:
Focus at least the first month on settling in and keeping up with your classes. Also spend that time speaking with upperclassmen to get targeted tips and advice re: outlining and exams. As you build relationships with upperclassmen, you should be able to get old outlines from them and from outline banks they have access to.
Whenever you do end up starting to outline, make sure you leave time to turn your regular outline for each class into an attack outline. Regular outlines aren’t too useful on exams and should really only be used to look up something obscure you didn’t address in your attack or for more details on something that’s in your attack, should you need it.
As you start outlining, you’ll likely develop your own style. While some parts might be universal, many aren’t. For example, I did a lot of my attack outlines in a “skull and bones” style that I picked up from one of the old outlines I came across. Some people make 100-page regular outlines and then cut that down by 10x for their attack. Some people have 30-page outlines for the same class and cut it down by 5x for their attack. Some people end up with overly long attacks (I wouldn’t recommend doing that).
A possible time to start outlining would be after you’ve reached a checkpoint in a class. When that is will vary by the class, but you’ll know it when you see it and some professors break up their syllabi into sections. Once you get your outlining started this way, you’ll have a better sense of how time consuming it is (or isn’t) for you and will be able to better time and schedule further outlining.
In addition to ensuring you leave time to build an attack outline before exams, make sure you save time for practice exams. Especially as a 1L, practice exams are so important. How many you’ll need will depend on the person, but don’t wait until the last minute to start taking them and don’t wait until your outline and attack outline are perfected to do them. It’s okay if you do 1 or 2 (depends on the person and class, so get more targeted advice from upperclassmen) before you know all the material.
Follow Up:
What are outlines? Applying to law schools this cycle so a lot of this is foreign to me.
Sharper Statements:
An organized summary of information learned for the course. An attack outline is a mulled-down version of an outline.
Question:
What are exams like?
Sharper Statements:
Depends on the exam and school. The most common exam is the issue spotter. You’ll be given a hypothetical scenario (fact pattern) followed by a prompt or multiple ones and you basically need to analyze the fact pattern within the confines of the applicable law. Some exams will have multiple choice questions similar to the bar exam. Some will have policy questions mixed with issue spotters. Some will have some short answer questions. Some will have word counts; some won’t. All depends on the professor’s style.
Question:
What sort of students score a BL summer job their 1L year??
TryMyBanana:
Check out this AMA: https://reddit.com/r/lawschooladmissions/comments/cicucx/uva_student_finishing_a_1l_summer_associate/
Hstrat:
Short answer:
It’s usually either high performing students (IIRC, at least above median after Fall semester) with a diverse background/heritage, or still higher-performing non-diverse students at T14s.
For the non-diverse students, most of the jobs are in “secondary” markets, meaning markets other than NYC and DC. In many of those cases, having ties to those markets is extremely helpful.
Sharper Statements:
Something to add, though it might already be in the other thread, is that there are some fellowship programs that include automatic 1L SA positions. I don’t have all the details on it, but here’s an example of a big firm posting about such opportunities on its website: https://www.perkinscoie.com/en/about-us/careers/summer-program/1l-opportunities.html.
Question:
Is it possible or reasonable to work part-time on some evenings and weekend during 1L?
Sharper Statements:
I’d wait until at least the spring to consider it. If you do well in the fall and had a ton of extra time on your hands, then maybe you could work a few hours/week. Would really depend on the person, with most people better off not working during 1L. Also keep in mind that 1L grades >>> everything else.
TryMyBanana:
I’m strongly against this. 1L grades are so, so important for securing employment. I wouldn’t risk harming my academic success with part-time work. Maybe reevaluate once you’ve finished the fall semester, but meh.
Oldersupersplitter:
I wouldn’t risk harming my academic success entire career trajectory with
part time work.
Question:
How difficult was your coursework in your 1L year? How different was the workload compared to Undergrad?
Also, NYU Law is a top choice for me. UG major was in engineering. GPA was 3.6 LSAT projected to in mid 160s. Any tips/advice to strengthen my chances of getting into NYU? (I wanna go into IP/Patent Law.)
Sharper Statements:
I had a dual-curriculum for most of my life including college (Jewish courses in addition to the regular college ones). So, I was used to having a ton of work. With that said, most people tend to find law school coursework more demanding because you have a ton of reading (in a style foreign to most people), a new format for exams (and usually one exam that’s your entire grade), and need to outline and reoutline to put yourself in the best position to succeed.
The key to success is to figure out what works quickly. The goal isn’t to study harder than the next person, but smarter. Find out what’s worked for upperclassmen and then determine what would work best for you. Maybe taking the same approach you did in college would work; maybe that approach isn’t ideal for law school. There’s more than one way to succeed, but there are also a ton of ways to do the opposite.
Quick note on NYU. NYU has one fewer doctrinal class than most others schools during each semester of 1L, and it’s Legal Writing class (Lawyering) is P/F. That’s a time and stress benefit (so makes the adjustment easier), but don’t be fooled into thinking that gives you an advantage. Classes are still graded on a curve and everyone is getting that same benefit.
Best way to improve your chances of getting into NYU is by improving your LSAT. I’d aim for 172+. I got into NYU with a 170/3.49, but it was by the skin of my teeth (off the WL in July).
TryMyBanana:
I found 1L to be difficult because preparing for class and exams was wildly different from undergrad. The material is new to you (i.e. case law) and the point of each reading isn’t obvious at first (i.e. extracting a holding and understanding where that case slots within your syllabus). And then there’s exams. Having a single exam represent your entire semester’s work is nerve-wracking and the format is very different from anything I encountered in undergrad.
That said, it’s all very learnable and everyone is basically struggling alongside you.
I was 2 years out of undergrad when I started, and the workload was different because I had been an awful, undisciplined student in undergrad, who would sit in the library and do nothing for hours. In law school, I was much more focused on my work and doing well. I didn’t end up working harder than I did in undergrad but was much better at just grinding through my work instead of goofing around or getting hammered all the time.
As for getting into NYU, get a higher LSAT score. Obviously your GPA is no longer within your control, but you can continue grinding out your LSAT studying. Law school admissions is largely a numbers game, so no amount of tweaking your app will help you significantly more than simply improving your numbers.
Question:
Hi! Thank you for taking your time to help us! Incoming 1L at NYU 🤞🏻 and I was wondering if doing a summer internship at an overseas Biglaw office (say Shanghai or Hong Kong) for 1L summer would hurt landing a position in NYC Biglaw for 2L? Any insight appreciated!
Sharper Statements:
A friend of mine at NYU took a summer job at a firm overseas (don’t think it was BL) and was swimming in offers from top firms during 2L OCI. His GPA was above median (but well below the cutoffs for most top firms) and, if anything, I’d say the overseas experience helped him. He also spoke a few languages and was an elite interviewer (or at least I’d assume based on my interactions with him), which definitely helps.
There might be some concern over flight risk, but I wouldn’t worry too much about it, especially with a 1L summer job, and especially since you’d be working for a BL firm—that probably has a US office. Also, I don’t think any small concern would warrant taking a public interest job in the US if you’d prefer to do BL overseas (the benefits of working BL your first summer would probably outweigh any minimal flight-risk concern).
TryMyBanana:
Doesn’t hurt. Some BL offices can be sensitive to ties to the area, but NYC is known for not caring. The general assumption is that you want to be in NYC, and they need so many bodies that it doesn’t really matter.
Follow Up:
I guess a follow up question would be that if I have two options, a PI job in a US city or a BL job overseas, which would be more preferable or does it not matter at all?
TryMyBanana:
Prior experience in BL is probably better. They’ll know that you have a sense for what the work is like, etc. However, any other legal job your 1L summer is just fine since most 1Ls won’t land a BL SA for their first summer.
I wouldn’t worry too much about what your 1L job is as long as it’s in the legal field and you can speak coherently about the legal tasks you did.
Oldsupersplitter:
I don’t think so. The main quality needed for a 1L job is that you’re doing legal work with at least moderate substance. Working at a firm looks great, even if it’s overseas. Are you afraid they’d look at you as a flight risk? You can just tell them that you took it because it was the best opportunity available, or because you wanted to check or the international market before settling in NYC.
Question:
Are good Career Services offices able to help students get jobs that they might not be able to get on their own?
Sharper Statements:
The thing with career services is that even within the same career services office, quality can vary. You’ll have the more experienced veteran counselors and the newer ones who are just getting their feet wet. It’s a good idea to start building relationships with the office early and to determine which ones are the good ones, and then further build relationships with them.
They can definitely help you branch out your network and connect with alumni from different firms, which can hopefully get you in the door for interviews. They might even be close with some alumni they’ve helped previously at big firms and can help you inch your way in there. Some of them might be close with people at public interest firms or the like and can get you in the door. They might have a network throughout your school and can connect you with someone not specifically in career services to then help you make another connection.
In short, I don’t think that career services has special powers to land you a job (unless it’s school-sponsored), but they can help you get yourself in a position to land a job that you may not have been connected with otherwise and they can start the networking train going for you through their various networks.
Question:
Almost every law school student who I’ve talked to has loathed or struggled in Civ Pro. Are there any skills I can sharpen or books I can read before law school to at least make that course seem less difficult?
Sharper Statements:
I don’t think it would be beneficial to prepare for Civ Pro before law school.
Probably the best way to succeed in Civ Pro would be to outline each subject area after completing it. Finish Personal Jurisdiction? Take a few hours to outline and understand it. Subject Matter Jurisdiction? Do the same. But here’s the caveat: make sure you speak to upperclassmen who took your professor to make sure you’re focusing on the right things. (I agree with TryMyBanana’s point that you shouldn’t over-focus on Civ Pro to the detriment of your other classes. Make sure you find the right balance.)
Some professors will want you to key in on the evolution of the law, while others may simply want you to understand the black letter law, with the cases being secondary. If you know how your professor wants you to understand it and write about it on exams, you’ll know how to best outline it. As you get further into the semester, start distilling that outline into an attack outline (see my comment on outlining) and then take a lot of practice exams.
I didn’t use a supplement per se for Civ Pro, but I did listen to Professor Arthur Miller’s audio CDs, which explained the material very well. Added benefit was that he was my professor, so I was learning the law the way he saw it. Any chance you have to use a supplement or audio CDs your professor wrote/recorded, do so.
TryMyBanana:
I personally liked CivPro, but definitely found it to be difficult. That said, don’t be intimidated by it or what others say. It’s eminently learnable. Just requires more thinking about the cases and what’s discussed in class.
I didn’t find Glannon’s E&E or Freer’s Barbri lectures to be that helpful, but YMMV/it depends on your professor. My prof taught CivPro in a way that diverged from both resources.
Don’t over-commit resources to CivPro. At my school, it was worth 1 credit more than my other classes, but I know students who threw everything at CivPro to the detriment of their other classes.
Oldersupersplitter:
I loved Civ Pro. In fact, it’s been my favorite class so far. I think part of it is your luck with professors (mine was super clear and engaging), but just letting you know that it doesn’t have to be inherently horrible. If you want to look up some stuff beforehand, you can try Richard Freer’s Barbri audio lectures, Glannon’s Civ Pro supplement (Examples & Explanations series), and Spencer’s “Acing Civil Procedure.”
Sharper Statements:
Just wanted to add that I’d recommend being very hesitant with reading any supplements prior to law school. There are many posts on this subject on various forums, but some of the stated concerns are that you’ll learn something the wrong way (each professor teaches their own way, especially with Civ Pro) or that you’ll risk being overconfident with your knowledge when you start law school (and may not be as focused on learning the material or might be stubborn about accepting your professor’s differing opinion).
Question:
If you didn’t do so great during 1L, are you completely screwed from getting a job second summer? Where to go from here if you did just under median?
Oldsupersplitter:
Depends on the school. This is where school rank matters most (rather than small differences in elite opportunities at the top). How bad can your GPA and still get a good job and a 2L? I know plenty of below median people at UVA getting callbacks and jobs (though it’d be easier if their grades were better), while at some schools it probably would be doom, at least for BigLaw.
Either way, you can always get a job later, after OCI, it’s just much much harder. First step is to talk to career services and milk them for all the advice and connections you can. Second, focus on getting better grades 2L and strategizing classes to do so. Third, network your f*ing face off with employers to build relationships and try to talk your way in. Fourth, blanket every law firm in your target market and backup markets with direct applications. Fifth, do OCI as a 3L if they let you.
Sharper Statements:
Oldsupersplitter’s answer is spot on. Just want to add one thing: sharpen your interviewing skills and do as many mock interviews as possible.
If you’re below median at a top school, you’ll get interviews, but your skills will be more crucial than they’d be for the top students. The top students will get job offers even if they’re super awkward (they won’t get offers across the board, but they’ll get at least some), while below median students (especially those far below median) will be scrutinized more closely.
If you’re below median at a lower-ranked school, getting interviews in the first place will be extremely difficult (if almost impossible, depending on the school), but, if you do get some, you will be scrutinized a ton and it will be the kickass interviewers, who make exceptional impressions, who will get the offers.
Try to do some mock interviews with actual BL associates. If there are firms that are clearly out of range for you, try to reach out to alums at the firm and ask them if they’d be willing to do some mock interviews with you and give you feedback. If you’re unsure who best to contact, speak to career services and get their input. Maybe they’ll even make the connections for you.
I hope it works out for you!
TryMyBanana:
There are definitely BL-specific interviewing quirks, but truly it’s about connecting with the interviewer and coming off as a likeable potential colleague. I would second sharperstatements’ advice to do mock interviews. Many firms do mock interview programs with ALSAs and your OCS will also do them. Take advantage, but don’t stress too much.
Question:
How does a BL SA internship turn into a full time job offer? What are some things SA’s can do during their summer to land a job offer?
Sharper Statements:
The top big firms, that have huge classes, pretty much hire everyone, unless something ridiculous happens. There are other firms that simply won’t hire their entire class each summer (check NALP to get a sense of offer percent for each firm). Then there are firms that fall in the middle—their goal is to hire the entire class, but will no-offer a summer for much less than the top big firms.
For the top big firms, just don’t do anything ridiculous.
For the we-don’t-hire-our-entire-class, don’t take an offer there unless it’s your only option. If you do, just do your best job possible without trying too hard to stand out. Stay late when necessary. Get your work done on time. Network. Communicate clearly and positively. Be positive. Don’t be difficult. Don’t complain. Do good work. Be likable.
For the firms that fall in the middle, take a similar approach to the previous group, but try to blend in. Unlike the we-don’t-hire-our-entire-class, where the offer is yours to win, this group the offer is yours to lose. So, don’t try to be that guy. Don’t try to prove that you’re indispensable. Don’t try to be the smartest summer associate. Avoid doing things that will make you stand out: get your work done on time, be competent, participate in firm summer activities, still stay late when necessary (but don’t do it too often and only do it at the expense of a summer activity if completely necessary), communicate clearly and positively, do good work, don’t be difficult, don’t complain, and be likable.
Question:
Late to the AMA but do any current/former law students have any opinions on joint-degree programs (LLM, MPA, etc)?? Are they worth the hassle?
Sharper Statements:
I’d only do one if you’re going into a field where such degrees are required or strongly encouraged. For example, tax attorneys often get tax LLMs.
Question:
How did you know what type of law you wanted to study/focus on? How much trial and error does the law school curriculum allow you to do before finally deciding on the one
My background has nothing to do with any type of law and I have no idea what I might prefer since I know so little about the legal world at the moment. Simply reading the descriptions of the different genres of lawyers didn’t really help. I wish there were like a personality test type of thing for me to find out which practice area would be my best match.
Sharper Statements:
Don’t worry too much about it, especially during 1L. Try to explore an area you may be interested in during your 1L summer and maybe experiment with an elective or two during 2L. Depending when you look for your 2L summer job (could be before 2L starts for the more competitive ones), you should again grab one in a field you’re interested in. Hopefully by 3L, you have a clear idea of what you want to do and study.
Some Caveats:
- If you’re going into BL, you’re likely to only know if you want corporate vs. litigation, and both areas have a wide range of courses you can take. Moreover, which classes you take won’t be too important, if at all, as you’re going to learn/relearn everything on the job.
- If you’re at a T2/T3, your school will likely encourage you to take courses that are tested on the bar exam, and that’s not a bad thing. Such courses tend to be useful in most fields and are interesting (e.g., evidence, criminal procedure, etc.).
I’d say that having a sense of your career goals tends to be most important with people going into the medium- to high-prestige public interest jobs, as they’ll want to get experience in clinics during 2L and 3L. If you think you might end up taking that route, do a clinic during 2L. Worst case, you get some good real-world experience and develop general skills that will help you in any legal position.
Whatever path you take, make sure to take at least one or two classes purely for your own enjoyment. Always wanted to study environmental law? Do it. This will likely be your last chance to study in a real classroom setting. Take advantage of it.
TryMyBanana:
You’ll figure it out during the year and at your 1L and 2L summer internships. I know that’s not very reassuring, but it’s definitely true. There are so many people who figure it out once they start law school.
You get electives to explore your interests starting 2L (and some schools have some 1L electives).
Question:
I understand there are different ways to succeed and that I need to figure out which works best for me, but how will I do that? How will I know if I should brief every case? How will I know if I should be using supplements? Also, how do I figure out which upperclassmen did well in a class?
Sharper Statements:
Briefing: I generally advise against it. You can try it out at first and see if it helps you understand things better (enough better relative to the time commitment) and go from there. If at any point you feel like the time it takes outweighs the benefit, stop.
Supplements: That’s an upperclassmen thing. Speak to the ones who did well in the class and ask them. You’ll likely get some variety in the answers. Then try them out. See which appeal to your style of learning. You’ll usually be able to tell if the supplement is helping based on how well you understand the material. If you find the supplement leaves you more confused, you probably don’t want to use it. If you find it clears things up, that’s a good sign.
Old Outlines: I’m adding this in because it’s related to the supplements section. Old outlines are similar to supplements in that their purpose is to help you understand the material. They’re a little different in that they’re also good to use as a foundation for your outlines. If you use supplements, make sure to try old outlines, too, to see which you find more helpful.
It’s important to remember that one of the main things that’s determinate of one’s success in law school is how fast they can figure out what works for them. Obviously, other things matter, too. But those who figure out how to study smart tend to do better than those who don’t and simply study hard.
Upperclassmen: Get to know people, make friends. You might make friends with upperclassmen who weren’t top of their class, but they’ll probably be able to advise you on who to speak to. They may also have good advice, but be extra careful if they didn’t do well in their classes. Speak to people in your affinity group or a club, etc. You’ll usually have a nice breakdown of people in such groups, and there will often be go-to people for advice.
People often say that everyone at a good school is going to know the material cold by finals. That’s not true. No matter how prestigious the school, many, if not most, people will still be trying to grasp all the concepts when finals roll around (especially in the tougher classes). That’s why it’s so key to figure out what works for you early on. Don’t force yourself to keep doing something that isn’t helping just because someone suggested it or it’s working for your friend. I mean, don’t quit something that’s commonly advised after a few days, but don’t force yourself to keep doing it if it hasn’t helped for a few weeks already. And if it’s something that clearly doesn’t fit with your learning style, you might stop doing it even after just a week. Ultimately, a lot of this ends up being a judgment call, and sometimes only you can be the judge.
Question:
I’m a non-traditional applicant and will therefore be an older student. I know what it means to work extremely hard and long hours in the real world, and am stoked on going back to school. I also know what R&R / personal hobbies I need to stay happy, so:
Will I have time to stay on top of my exercise, sleep, and the rare 2 day getaway (camping, staycation, etc)?
Sharper Statements:
You should have time to stay on top of exercise and sleep. The key is to study smart rather than simply studying hard. Best way to find out what works is to speak to upperclassmen in your specific classes, as what works best for each class varies by professor.
As for 2-day getaways, it will depend on when in the semester and how ahead of schedule you are. Many people in my class would go to UVA for a weekend softball tournament each spring, some of whom had tippy-top grades.
Question:
Did you work at all during your first year of law school or know someone that did? How did that affect studies?
Sharper Statements:
I didn’t and don’t really know anyone who did. I did have a lot of free time on my hands, and used that time for excessive unwinding. I’m sure plenty of people were in similar shoes to me, while maybe some others would be fine doing some light side-work and spending less time unwinding.
Note: The “a lot” was more during 2L and 3L. Law school becomes a blur overtime and it’s easy for the years to get mushed together.
Follow Up:
Thanks for the response! Considering working very part time at a coffee shop on my free days, I’m happy to hear there’s a lot of free time.
Sharper Statements:
To be clear: I don’t think my extra time is representative of the usual student experience and the “lots” of free time was more during 2L and 3L. Think of law school, at least 1L, as a 9-5 (or 9-6) job with busy season around finals time.
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That’s it! Thanks for reading. Please feel free to contact me at moshe@sharperstatements.com with any questions about law school or admissions.